Realm: Mistblade Mistblade vol.2 feedback & ideas.

[Aithne]

To clarify, the ONLY situation where anti-ninjalooting measures can be enforced is in pre-invited Masterloot/restricted rolling (Need Before Greed) environments where the raid leader/master looter have laid out the rolling/item auction rules IN RAID CHAT (or any other INGAME channel which EVERYONE can and provably did see), and then distributes an item to a person who, according to those laid-down rules, did NOT win the item, OR when the raid leader promised something other than masterloot and sets the loot rules to masterloot before an important boss dies. Those are the ABSOLUTE ONLY cases where you can even THINK about enforcing ninjalooting-related rules, and the only enforcement you can do is redistributing an item...

 

Say, in a "main spec need, off spec greed" environment, if the raid leader fails to disclose publicly that the bear tank will be rolling on healer leather as their main spec (and pass on agility leather), but does disclose that it's "ms need os greed", then the tank needing on healer leather can be attacked, and the only penalty they'd suffer is redistribution of an item, after which, if the tank's loot preferences are disclosed, for the remaining bosses they'd probably be allowed to roll on healer leather. This scenario is clearly non-malicious, as the tank/rl just failed to disclose something that can easily exist as a good faith agreement, and so, the bear does not deserve punishment. This is one of the more frequent types of loot "misdistribution", and one of the more problematic ones, as usually "Bearbutt will be rolling on healer items ms" is disclosed on external channels, which one person always fails to participate in, and it's not provable one way or the other.

A more clear cut ninjalooting scenario would be if the aforementioned bear tank (and the raid leader) DID disclose that the bear tank would be rolling for a healer mainspec, but they rolled on a best-in-slot tank trinket anyway and won against the other tank, who very clearly went there for tank items. In such a scenario, people can usually talk it out, since "reflexive needing" is a thing, BUT if the bear fails to trade the tank trinket, this is very much enforceable if the other tank can prove that the bear 1. disclosed intention against rolling on tank items and 2. rolled on a tank item anyway and 3. the other tank would have won the roll had the bear not rolled. In Masterloot environments, the ML distributing an item to 2nd highest roll or 2nd highest bidder is something similar, but this one has the extra proof requirement of timestamps, which 98% of people are incapable of turning on so they can get fucked with their 35 second late /roll.

The third "archetype" of ninjalooting is when the rl promises one loot distribution method and switches to another one, such as "roll for everything, even mounts", but before Ji-Kun, sneakily switches to master looter and distributes the mount to themself. This is the "easiest" to prove, and the most malicious, but also the rarest, AND redistribution here is the most problematic, since the remaining members have to come to an agreement of sorts, such as rolling among all of them and submitting that roll to support along with their complaint.

 

NOTHING ELSE that people have been bitching about constitutes ninjalooting, it's either "allowed and intended behavior" or "your own fucking fault for not paying attention", and the above listed cases, while they have happened, and were, in fact, enforced on Tauri (which is why I know how to outline them so clearly), are simply not frequent enough to warrant exposing the gms to an absolute flurry of "boo hoo this raid geared idiot dared roll need on an item in RHC", which are just absolute bullshit reports, and I have SERIOUS doubts that the server population could even be trained to rigorously prove that anything was ninja'd in the above cases.

I am also not against the head gm or other lead support staff asking about and following these guidelines to very clearly and specifically define the ninjalooting cases where, if someone DOES provide rigorous enough proof, they do redistribute the item, but I also don't blame them for not doing any of this, since the overwhelming majority of ninjaloot complaints is still just absolute bullshit.

[YomigoSan]

Hello

I don't get good ping on this server and I only have good ping on some servers

But all servers that have a proxy give me good ping

If you can, please add a proxy to new realm so that my friends and I can play with good ping

Thanks for your good server

Edited November 14, 2023 by YomigoSan

[Tiamek]

On 11/12/2023 at 11:08 AM, Aithne said:

 

Aithne, all I said there's NO reason why a Hunter should Need on a spirit ring. The default rule should not be "Ninja unless I say otherwise." The Greed button was invented for a reason.

[Aithne]

It is assumed that people who organize raids know how to play the game.

It's not even that difficult to ask the RL to set it on Need Before Greed or some other, even more controlled loot distribution system. I know that bitching about these loot distribution systems was what made Blizz just stick with Personal Loot everywhere, but MoP client is what it is, and any default we set (Group Loot, which was the default on retail, or NBG, which is a slightly more restricted Group Loot) is still incapable of dealing with the stricter definitions of "Need" that arise in raid settings (like druids who could still roll need on about three times as many trinkets as there are specs they actively intend to play), so you'll have to face the fact that either the raid leader puts active effort into determining loot distribution, costing the raid time, or someone you think shouldn't be needing on shit will need on shit. In that sense, the default being unrestricted Group Loot is the best option to visually display raid leaders who have no business leading a raid. The default is insufficient PRECISELY because there is no good default "automatic" method available.

[Velaurius]

Can you please allow us to transfer our brought NPC pets as well, I was a pet collector and brought Lil Rag from the shop can I please have it on v2

[ICritMyKilt]

On 10/11/2023 at 6:49 AM, Crysis said:

Ninja-looting is troublesome to monitor. Mostly due to too many of class/spec combinations. And it's usually ultra hard to prove.

Yeah, but it is very frustrating when you are trying to level/gear a character and people roll need just because they can.  I've lost gear in normal pandaria dungeons to guys with an average ilvl of 535+.  I've also lost gear to people that it doesn't do any good for their class, but the game gave them a need roll and they took it.  I've seen enchanters rolling need so they could increase the odds they'd get the item to disenchant it. My friend ran around with a green weapon and shield on his tankadin for awhile because he kept losing the viable drops to holy paladins, melee DPS and enchanters. I wish there was a way to mitigate it, like if the tank rolls on the tank shield and the arms warrior and the holy paladin roll on it, then the tank gets a bonus on his roll or the off-spec rolls are ignored.  Take that a step further, if the game could compare the equipped item and determine that your 550 ilvl shield is probably better than the 463 shield you just rolled on.

[Aithne]

2 minutes ago, ICritMyKilt said:

Yeah, but it is very frustrating when you are trying to level/gear a character and people roll need just because they can.  I've lost gear in normal pandaria dungeons to guys with an average ilvl of 535+.  I've also lost gear to people that it doesn't do any good for their class, but the game gave them a need roll and they took it.  I've seen enchanters rolling need so they could increase the odds they'd get the item to disenchant it. My friend ran around with a green weapon and shield on his tankadin for awhile because he kept losing the viable drops to holy paladins, melee DPS and enchanters. I wish there was a way to mitigate it, like if the tank rolls on the tank shield and the arms warrior and the holy paladin roll on it, then the tank gets a bonus on his roll or the off-spec rolls are ignored.  Take that a step further, if the game could compare the equipped item and determine that your 550 ilvl shield is probably better than the 463 shield you just rolled on.

Random heroics will NEVER be policed. Not in this life, not in the next one, not even on a server where there are actual rules against ninjalooting will you see RDF loot distribution policed, and we are not going to implement abusable non-transparent stopgap measures just so the loot goes to who you specifically think it should go to, either. There are multiple sources of high item level weapons even in 5.0, including world drops, crafted weapons, and rep rewards, and if you are a tankadin, you will insta-pop your queues anyway.

[joet34]

On 10/13/2023 at 6:38 PM, Tiamek said:

WoW was not intended to have PvP. That's why they invented the Battle Fatigue stat, Resil, PvP Power, combat timers, all these modifications to compensate for the natural character. You walk into a raid and nothing changes. You walk into a BG / Arena, you have all these modifications to your stats and gearscore scaling, indicating that your character needs to be different to PvP.

But I understand why Stormforge turns it on, as it's inclusive to those who want it, and it accurately reflects the lore.

WoW was intended to have pvp hence the name world of warcraft..if it wasn't they wouldn't have added bg's in classic and made all realms pve. If you don't like pvp don't play the server, if you like mistblade and looking forward to misblade 2 then stop whining and get on with the game it's really that simple crysis said they won't ever make the realm pve so there really isn't any point in crying about it. The reason for the battle fatigue is people were being one shot by other players especially with chaos bolt. (This isn't intended as a flame post but people need to stop whining about pve servers)

1) A catch up system for the legendary cloak for people who start late/ for alts.

2) A bonus Exp/Rep Weekend like someone else has said.

3) Make AV require less players as i've not been in AV on mb

4) An incentive for players to continue doing Raid Finder (Qued for Soo and everyone apart from me and 2 others left)

 

 

[xunlich]

Can join the transmogrify, account universal, including heirloom collection ? If there is, it is the best !

[Query]

5 hours ago, xunlich said:

Can join the transmogrify, account universal, including heirloom collection ? If there is, it is the best !

This is not feasible and it wont happen mainly because it requires a lot of work behind the sides + client editing. This is a feature from later expansions which will eventually arrive to Stormforge

[xunlich]

On 11/21/2023 at 8:56 PM, Query said:

This is not feasible and it wont happen mainly because it requires a lot of work behind the sides + client editing. This is a feature from later expansions which will eventually arrive to Stormforge

Thank you for your reply🫡

[Merdon]

Bug Report: Pet Battle Slots Locked after Checking out MB1 Characters.

Hail & Well Met

I've recently been leveling up pets on MB2 and decided to check out my roster from MB1.  I noticed on MB1 my pet interface reset (as if it was a fresh account).  Then logging back on MB2 the pet interface reset again locking my slots.  Attached is a screenshot.

I leveled an alt to see if redoing the achievement would unlock it, but it does not.  Clearing Cache & WTF Folder did not work either.

Your Help is Much Appreciated!

Edited November 27, 2023 by Merdon
+info

[Kay20]

On 11/5/2023 at 1:35 AM, Aithne said:

You do not know the reasons for them rolling on stuff. Often, they are collecting either offspec gear or best in slot items for Challenge Modes (CM does not care about item level, only sockets). It IS intended behavior, and I happen to know how and why it works the way it does, because I wrote it. I also DID play through an entire, VERY LONG MoP expansion on Tauri up until 14/14 heroic SoO and have, at certain points during my life, Needed items that were below the item level of what I had equipped at the time for the aforementioned purposes. What people Need in heroic dungeons from items their class can use is entirely their own business, not ours, and MoP heroics are cheap enough to run that it should not cripple you if you happen to not get loot for one particular run.

We will NOT ban people for items they are meant to be able to roll Need on for legitimate purposes. No sane HC raid geared person would run poop tier content with potentially dumb, undergeared, or foreign language-speaking randoms if they didn't ACTUALLY need something from the dungeon, right?

so people even saying they are needing for GOLD. thats still not ninja looting when others could use it too? i would get its for offspec. but still. needing on any green or anything that drops just because you can, doesnt mean its how its suppose to work. thats not how you have a community in a game at all. it brings such toxic environments doing that. i shouldnt be forced to have to do a full premade group just because dont want to police something thats a NORMAL GMS job

 

[ICritMyKilt]

9 minutes ago, Kay20 said:

so people even saying they are needing for GOLD. thats still not ninja looting when others could use it too? i would get its for offspec. but still. needing on any green or anything that drops just because you can, doesnt mean its how its suppose to work. thats not how you have a community in a game at all. it brings such toxic environments doing that. i shouldnt be forced to have to do a full premade group just because dont want to police something thats a NORMAL GMS job

 

I totally agree that it sucks and it is not right for people to roll need for anything other than main spec unless no one actually needs for main spec or they made some sort of agreement with the group that they would roll off spec gear as main spec. The problem is there is not an army of GMs with the time that would be required to investigate ninja claims and react appropriately. For dungeons especially, it is just not worth the effort to try to intervene and figure out if your ninja claim is legitimate and that the other person's right to roll was not legitimate.

[Aithne]

25 minutes ago, Kay20 said:

so people even saying they are needing for GOLD.

I very much doubt that you can prove this, either on a case-by-case basis or that this is the dominant sentiment (most people needing offspec gear actually seem to be gearing up for their offspec), but why not just, idk, offer them fucking 20-50 gold for the item if they are nice about it and played well so far, OR if someone is provably trolling, votekick as intended and then run, like, three more dungeons to get equivalently good gear?

The very purpose of RHC is to allow people to gear up. If we prevented ppl from needing for gear that is offspec for them, we would literally fucking KILL THE ENTIRE PURPOSE OF RHC. Imagine if the most entry-level basic fucking gearing method was not available for gearing anything but your strongest spec. What would the fucking PURPOSE of that be? Opportunity to roll is already automatically enforced, and "right to roll" is assumed to exist because of that unless VERY RIGOROUSLY proven otherwise. For example, if someone has a lengthy history of bitching on the forums, discord, or even external platforms about "druid/paladin tank needed a healer item claiming to have a healer offspec BAN THIS NINJA", being rejected, and then spouting "Stormforge doesn't ban ninja looters so IMMA NEED EVERYTHING AND RUB IT IN", that's ban worthy. A dps needing on tank gear, very possibly intending to tank? What the fuck are we supposed to do about it, follow that player for two weeks to check whether they actually end up putting together a tank gear and tanking?

No, "ninjalooting" in dungeons is not and will not ever be punished because it is NOT EVEN NINJALOOTING. It's legitimate gameplay behavior and the intended use of the system to be able to gear up your offspec, and an overwhelming majority of "ninja" claims can legitimately be explained by offspec gear claims.

[Kay20]

22 minutes ago, Aithne said:

I very much doubt that you can prove this, either on a case-by-case basis or that this is the dominant sentiment (most people needing offspec gear actually seem to be gearing up for their offspec), but why not just, idk, offer them fucking 20-50 gold for the item if they are nice about it and played well so far, OR if someone is provably trolling, votekick as intended and then run, like, three more dungeons to get equivalently good gear?

The very purpose of RHC is to allow people to gear up. If we prevented ppl from needing for gear that is offspec for them, we would literally fucking KILL THE ENTIRE PURPOSE OF RHC. Imagine if the most entry-level basic fucking gearing method was not available for gearing anything but your strongest spec. What would the fucking PURPOSE of that be? Opportunity to roll is already automatically enforced, and "right to roll" is assumed to exist because of that unless VERY RIGOROUSLY proven otherwise. For example, if someone has a lengthy history of bitching on the forums, discord, or even external platforms about "druid/paladin tank needed a healer item claiming to have a healer offspec BAN THIS NINJA", being rejected, and then spouting "Stormforge doesn't ban ninja looters so IMMA NEED EVERYTHING AND RUB IT IN", that's ban worthy. A dps needing on tank gear, very possibly intending to tank? What the fuck are we supposed to do about it, follow that player for two weeks to check whether they actually end up putting together a tank gear and tanking?

No, "ninjalooting" in dungeons is not and will not ever be punished because it is NOT EVEN NINJALOOTING. It's legitimate gameplay behavior and the intended use of the system to be able to gear up your offspec, and an overwhelming majority of "ninja" claims can legitimately be explained by offspec gear claims.

ive had people even said they needed for gold when i asked why they need on everything. multiple times

[Kay20]

23 minutes ago, Aithne said:

I very much doubt that you can prove this, either on a case-by-case basis or that this is the dominant sentiment (most people needing offspec gear actually seem to be gearing up for their offspec), but why not just, idk, offer them fucking 20-50 gold for the item if they are nice about it and played well so far, OR if someone is provably trolling, votekick as intended and then run, like, three more dungeons to get equivalently good gear?

The very purpose of RHC is to allow people to gear up. If we prevented ppl from needing for gear that is offspec for them, we would literally fucking KILL THE ENTIRE PURPOSE OF RHC. Imagine if the most entry-level basic fucking gearing method was not available for gearing anything but your strongest spec. What would the fucking PURPOSE of that be? Opportunity to roll is already automatically enforced, and "right to roll" is assumed to exist because of that unless VERY RIGOROUSLY proven otherwise. For example, if someone has a lengthy history of bitching on the forums, discord, or even external platforms about "druid/paladin tank needed a healer item claiming to have a healer offspec BAN THIS NINJA", being rejected, and then spouting "Stormforge doesn't ban ninja looters so IMMA NEED EVERYTHING AND RUB IT IN", that's ban worthy. A dps needing on tank gear, very possibly intending to tank? What the fuck are we supposed to do about it, follow that player for two weeks to check whether they actually end up putting together a tank gear and tanking?

No, "ninjalooting" in dungeons is not and will not ever be punished because it is NOT EVEN NINJALOOTING. It's legitimate gameplay behavior and the intended use of the system to be able to gear up your offspec, and an overwhelming majority of "ninja" claims can legitimately be explained by offspec gear claims.

its also about Loot ethics of a MMO. thinking about other players not just your self

[Aithne]

You are also only thinking of yourself. Instantly questioning the legitimacy of other people's roll on "YOUR ITEM" is pretty toxic, ngl.

And if there IS suspicion illegitimate behavior, immediately crying for a GM or any other authority instead of trying to solve it through one of the many provided ingame ways (some peaceful, others not so much) is also just... ridiculously self-centered, considering the limited GM resources we have for the playercount.

[Kay20]

8 minutes ago, Aithne said:

You are also only thinking of yourself. Instantly questioning the legitimacy of other people's roll on "YOUR ITEM" is pretty toxic, ngl.

And if there IS suspicion illegitimate behavior, immediately crying for a GM or any other authority instead of trying to solve it through one of the many provided ingame ways (some peaceful, others not so much) is also just... ridiculously self-centered, considering the limited GM resources we have for the playercount.

how is it toxic? and how am i thinking for my self?? when i said someone else is needing on everything for GOLD and straight up saying it? says the person that has to curse over explaining stuff. imagine someone having their own opinion.

[Kay20]

9 minutes ago, Aithne said:

You are also only thinking of yourself. Instantly questioning the legitimacy of other people's roll on "YOUR ITEM" is pretty toxic, ngl.

And if there IS suspicion illegitimate behavior, immediately crying for a GM or any other authority instead of trying to solve it through one of the many provided ingame ways (some peaceful, others not so much) is also just... ridiculously self-centered, considering the limited GM resources we have for the playercount.

never once said it was my item. its the GROUPS items. that is far to be rolled out to everyone. not just one person needing for their own gain. thats me being selfish?

[ICritMyKilt]

There are not enough GMs and it is not a big enough issue for them to intervene. Now as for fairness. If you have a ret paladin that has been sitting in the queues and farming trying to get better gear and then you have a healer/tank, who incidentally have way shorter queue times, that decide to build an off spec and they take main spec gear way from the DPS, that is not fair. Bad enough he could be rolling against other DPS for it. I would not roll off spec against main spec. It is just not nice.

Now I would point out the roll system still needs some tweaking. I was in a random earlier and got the option to need on a spirit trinket for my rogue.

[Kay20]

2 minutes ago, ICritMyKilt said:

There are not enough GMs and it is not a big enough issue for them to intervene. Now as for fairness. If you have a ret paladin that has been sitting in the queues and farming trying to get better gear and then you have a healer/tank, who incidentally have way shorter queue times, that decide to build an off spec and they take main spec gear way from the DPS, that is not fair. Bad enough he could be rolling against other DPS for it. I would not roll off spec against main spec. It is just not nice.

Now I would point out the roll system still needs some tweaking. I was in a random earlier and got the option to need on a spirit trinket for my rogue.

its not even just gear thats upgrades. its also like greens and any boes that people need on to sell. whole purpose of greed roll is for gold. i dont mind someone needing gear for an offspec at all. be my guest really. just feel its rude af to take away someones MS  gear when its just your offspec

 

[Aithne]

It's not rude, not in an RHC, not when "mainspec" and "offspec" are decided by a coin toss in several cases. Someone can be a mainspec healer but queue as tank because queues are just faster that way. Someone could have levelled as a dps spec but wants to go tank for their raid group. The spec people run dungeons with may not even BE their desired or functional main spec, or they may be just "flex spec", willing to play whatever their group needs. And these are the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of complaints, really. The sheer number of tickets we get over "offspec people ninja'ing mainspec items from me me me ME in RHC" is staggering and honestly bullshit, and the excessive ultra-needer trolls are a minority (and largely come from the disgruntled people whose "mainspec item got ninja'd by an offspeccer"), and if you can provide rigorous proof of trolling-level repeated, ultra-malicious offenses to high level support, I don't think there's an absolute unwillingness to punish, but you're not ever going to be able to prove sth rigorously enough, especially since you HAVE TOOLS TO DEAL WITH IT YOUSELF and aren't losing an excessive amount of ingame resources anyway (paying someone slightly over vendor value for your trinket if they only needed it for the gold sounds like an absolute non-issue and a very trivial courtesy, and votekicking is also super fucking easy). Still, if you feel like you can back up your otherwise-unresolvable malice claims, there is an e-mail address, for example, where you can post them without formatting limitations present in ingame tickets.

22 minutes ago, ICritMyKilt said:

Now I would point out the roll system still needs some tweaking. I was in a random earlier and got the option to need on a spirit trinket for my rogue.

This should only happen pre-60, and that does not need "tweaking", it's intended there, even on retail everyone could need on everything in vanilla content. If it's a spirit trinket in actually relevant content, pls post that on the bugtracker. The thing about the roll restrictions is that they are based entirely on clientside lootspec/bonusroll data, and that can be incomplete or inaccurate in some very rare cases, but I don't think I've seen one of those in MoP heroics.

[ICritMyKilt]

1 hour ago, Aithne said:

It's not rude, not in an RHC, not when "mainspec" and "offspec" are decided by a coin toss in several cases. Someone can be a mainspec healer but queue as tank because queues are just faster that way. Someone could have levelled as a dps spec but wants to go tank for their raid group. The spec people run dungeons with may not even BE their desired or functional main spec, or they may be just "flex spec", willing to play whatever their group needs. And these are the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of complaints, really. The sheer number of tickets we get over "offspec people ninja'ing mainspec items from me me me ME in RHC" is staggering and honestly bullshit, and the excessive ultra-needer trolls are a minority (and largely come from the disgruntled people whose "mainspec item got ninja'd by an offspeccer"), and if you can provide rigorous proof of trolling-level repeated, ultra-malicious offenses to high level support, I don't think there's an absolute unwillingness to punish, but you're not ever going to be able to prove sth rigorously enough, especially since you HAVE TOOLS TO DEAL WITH IT YOUSELF and aren't losing an excessive amount of ingame resources anyway (paying someone slightly over vendor value for your trinket if they only needed it for the gold sounds like an absolute non-issue and a very trivial courtesy, and votekicking is also super fucking easy). Still, if you feel like you can back up your otherwise-unresolvable malice claims, there is an e-mail address, for example, where you can post them without formatting limitations present in ingame tickets.

This should only happen pre-60, and that does not need "tweaking", it's intended there, even on retail everyone could need on everything in vanilla content. If it's a spirit trinket in actually relevant content, pls post that on the bugtracker. The thing about the roll restrictions is that they are based entirely on clientside lootspec/bonusroll data, and that can be incomplete or inaccurate in some very rare cases, but I don't think I've seen one of those in MoP heroics.

It happened on my 90 rogue in a MoP heroic. If it happens again, I will try to get screen grab and date/time details for a bug report.

[Aithne]

We only need the item name or names.