Realm: Netherwing Cross-Faction , PVE Yes, but in BGs please No!

[Hemoride]

I played BG all day, it makes a big part of why i like to play TBC . But now that fun is 0% 

Cross Faction PvP does not bring advantage in Queue times so far, But what it does: 

- Players care even less in playing together 
- It makes anyone "annonym" 
- before cross faction, if people didnt do well together, there was a chance to learn to play together and over sveral matches just get better 
  ... that totally disappeared now
- it increases the randomness "maybe i end up in winning team" and decreases the "work for do it better next match" 

In short it totally kills the quality of BGs 

Now its just about getting the fucking mark , no skill, no teamwork, no incentive for that 

Keep Cross Faction PVE 

But Please, No Cross FAction BGs ,...they are zero fun and just feel like a "roll"  

Edited July 4 by Hemoride

[PeterNemo]

Seeing that this post got 0 replies and only 1 like (mine), I´m not sure how many people actually read this forum, but I will none the less leave my comment here.

First of all, I 100% agree with the above post!

And then I would like to tell my story - I used to play a lot "back in the days" and just this February decided to give it a shot again on this server together with two of my real-life friends. This was a well thought-through decision, after considering content we liked in the past and content we didn´t like (eg. guildbanks good, deathknights bad, personal opinion only), population and the available servers.

We were very happy to find this server, quickly got leveled and started BGs, which is one of my favorite sides of the game, and the actual hard part, where I/we have to play other people and not just mobs and bosses with predictable behavior. We were also very happy with the community and people on the server, and in regards to queue times for BGs they were never longer than 1 BG (=23 mins) even when we joined as 3-man group.

A week or two before SWP/S4 release we were all well geared and had nothing more to gain in terms of honour or badges from BGs, and thus played them only for the challenge and fun. As the post above explains so well, that fun is now gone...

I think there are, in very general terms, two types of WoW players: The ones that focus on PvP and the ones that focus on PvE. The PvE´ers tend to me more social and talkative in /world and forums and naturally more interested in server/content progress, and in this case the admins have chosen to listen to the most loud-mouthed (i.e. PvE´ers) and made cross-faction in BGs, even tho the PvP´ers didn´t ask for it.

To me and my friends it has changed the game so much that we will not be playing unless the BG cross-faction is rolled back.

Two Knights and a Knight Lieutenent, with all available BG gear incl. standards, mounts etc., S2-4, working on last S4 pieces, 75k (max) honour points, raid geared and experienced, will no longer be joining the server.

If this was a deliberate attempt by the admins to make people leave, I think they have done a great job, but would have wished they would just have come clean from the beginning and told if the intentions are/were to close the server or progress to WOTLK or something else.

This cross-faction BGs is not a "fix", it is a deathblow!

 

TLDR: We are leaving cuz x-faction BGs!

[Pelto]

Sorry - but cross-faction BG was required and was also a highly requested item these past few months - especially with the server population dropping and also the longer queue times. Queue times are now much improved and we have received positive feedback on the system as well. Not everyone will be happy with every change we make.

We appreciate the feedback regardless - but it will not be reversed at this time.

Thanks,
GM Pelto

Edited July 6 by Pelto

[Pelto]

15 minutes ago, PeterNemo said:

If this was a deliberate attempt by the admins to make people leave, I think they have done a great job, but would have wished they would just have come clean from the beginning and told if the intentions are/were to close the server or progress to WOTLK or something else.

 

Completely incorrect - first off we will never move the server into Wrath nor will we ever close the server.  Also any change we put in is for the long-term benefit of the community - silly conspiracy theories like this are unproductive.

I advise you to watch discord - specifically the #pvp channel - discussions and activity are much higher there if you wish to provide feedback.

Edited July 6 by Pelto

[PeterNemo]

11 minutes ago, Pelto said:

I advise you to watch discord - specifically the #pvp channel - discussions and activity are much higher there if you wish to provide feedback.

Thank you very much for the fast reply. I have however provided my feedback and you have read it.

Edited July 6 by PeterNemo

[Hemoride]

14 hours ago, Pelto said:

Sorry - but cross-faction BG was required and was also a highly requested item these past few months - especially with the server population dropping and also the longer queue times. Queue times are now much improved and we have received positive feedback on the system as well. Not everyone will be happy with every change we make.

We appreciate the feedback regardless - but it will not be reversed at this time.

Thanks,
GM Pelto

Its a question Quality vs Quantity

Someone requesting that feature for PvP , likely was Pve'er and just joins BGs to farm honor/marks, no matter how,...if he could Afk/Bot it, he would do ,..thats not the kind of people you should want to support. 

Aomeone who wants a great match ,..maybe where both teams are good and its fucking annoying hard for both sides,..that one likely would not want cross faction BG as it makes anyone anonymn and quality goes downhill ,.....

So if you want to keep it like this for pvp now,..you might as well allow afking, and botting in BG ,..no big difference 

I made my point ,....Quality over Quantity ! 

PS: I played a lot BG last 2 weeks prior to Cross Faction,...I can not feel any substancial better Q time ,..it was good before ,..it is good now ,...just quality went downhill . 
(I also covered a lot of the timezones with that as I had a little addicted melddown the 2 weeks prior to cross faction pvp update,...the good news are , this update totally fixed my "addiction" ,..not playing anymore beside some pve scheduled raids,...so in some way i may should be greatful for that update)

[ICritMyKilt]

I haven't done a whole lot of PvP since xfac, but the few times I have done it, I do not see a significant improvement in queue times, but that can be subjective.  The thing is that the required number of people have to be in the queue for the particular BG for it to start.  Even though it is xfac, you still need enough people to have a BG, but xfac should provide a reduction in wait times simple because you will shove x number of pegs into x number of holes regardless of whether the holes or pegs are square or round, where as, non-xfac you could have 50 square pegs and 5 round ones and be waiting to fill those other round holes.

As far as working together goes, everyone should work on learning to function together without forming a pre-made.  If everyone calls out incoming and moves to the right place at the right time then you shouldn't need the same exact team members every match. I played horde and alliance in retail and private servers and everyone puts on their guild tabard the same way, no reason why we can't all work together.  Assuming that everyone around you is not in greens or trying to multibox/AFK their way through BGs for honor, you should be able to go into any BG with any group and call out incomings and communicate where help is needed and if everyone actually pays attention, you should be able to do good.  The other team may do better or worse, so it could be a win or a loss, but you shouldn't require running with the same people to be able to PvP.

Annonymous? Seriously?  There are not THAT many people on the server and it is not like we have cross-server BGs.  I see the same names frequently because the same smaller group of people are awake on my schedule and I don't know how anonymous you can be when I can see your name.  You could in-game stalk anyone fairly easily, so annonymous, I don't understand what you mean by that.

[Hemoride]

19 hours ago, ICritMyKilt said:

I haven't done a whole lot of PvP since xfac, but the few times I have done it, I do not see a significant improvement in queue times, but that can be subjective.  The thing is that the required number of people have to be in the queue for the particular BG for it to start.  Even though it is xfac, you still need enough people to have a BG, but xfac should provide a reduction in wait times simple because you will shove x number of pegs into x number of holes regardless of whether the holes or pegs are square or round, where as, non-xfac you could have 50 square pegs and 5 round ones and be waiting to fill those other round holes.

As far as working together goes, everyone should work on learning to function together without forming a pre-made.  If everyone calls out incoming and moves to the right place at the right time then you shouldn't need the same exact team members every match. I played horde and alliance in retail and private servers and everyone puts on their guild tabard the same way, no reason why we can't all work together.  Assuming that everyone around you is not in greens or trying to multibox/AFK their way through BGs for honor, you should be able to go into any BG with any group and call out incomings and communicate where help is needed and if everyone actually pays attention, you should be able to do good.  The other team may do better or worse, so it could be a win or a loss, but you shouldn't require running with the same people to be able to PvP.

Annonymous? Seriously?  There are not THAT many people on the server and it is not like we have cross-server BGs.  I see the same names frequently because the same smaller group of people are awake on my schedule and I don't know how anonymous you can be when I can see your name.  You could in-game stalk anyone fairly easily, so annonymous, I don't understand what you mean by that.

its simple psychology,..when i say "annonymus" , then i simply mean that people feel even less engaged, even less attached ,...its human psychology ,...have a big group and no clear rules and ruler ,..everyone will guess the otherone is doing it,..at the end noone did it,.....
apply same logic to BG,.... quality decreases as you increase the psychological "non attached" factor... 

I know we just need to work together ,..every single individum which isnt borderline retard, will know that ,..but thats not how group or mass psychology works,..... people in masses have not the iq they have of the single individum ,..its different and its retarded ,..was in all history, apoplies to politics, wars and even mmo's ,..as all have one in common,..people as individuum or as group ,...... 

when blizzard implemented cross server BGs in 1.12 i think it was,.... q times were amazing  ,..hurray ,..took like 2-3 days until everyone realized how shit the quality of the matches became (before cross server it was amazing ,...people actually cared and had some "reputation" to cared about ,.... 

I know we are not many people on server,m...but still same logic applies as this permanent switching of all ppl in groups just annomynizes things and elevates such effects i tried to describe ,.... anyways ,..thats here to stay ,... the world is not really known for following smart people who were right 😄 

[ICritMyKilt]

There was a period of time, I think during Cata, where they changed the brackets and 24 became a twink level.  At that time I had a 24 rogue, probably my favorite time for PvP.  I had a lot of fun with my 24 rogue in BGs. It was actually me and a few friends.  We played alliance and we had nelf hunters (for shadow meld) and rogues.  We named all the rogue Zeroskills with special characters replacing the vowels like with an accent mark over the i or something.  It got to the point that when a few of us were in a WSG together, our team would cheer and the other team would start losing people and then they'd roll characters on our realm so they could whisper us and ask how long we were going to be BGing so they could come back after we were done.  We definitely had a reputation and we learned the regulars that we faced often.

Yes, there is a tendancy for a lot of people to step back and let someone else handle stuff for them like mages assuming someone else will decurse and they just focus on getting more damage instead of doing the utility stuff.  If someone steps up and takes charge then even the most random PUG can be coordinated and I've seen that step back and wait for someone else to handle it stuff happen in pre-made groups too.  People are either willing to put in effort for a win or not; to listen and follow directions or not.  I see people bitch about it in chat how no one is listening and they all need to stop running to that one spot because the other team is too strong there and we need to follow certain strategies to win, but I was seeing those same rants before xfac too.

[Hemoride]

"stepp up take lead / willing to follow instruction" ,..

Yes, but in my opinion , the annonym effect caused by permanent being with different people , decreases amount of people willing to listen / follow ,.....increases "everyone for himself" effect ,........ 
And the praxis is showing it perfectly right now,...

Point is: even a Pug must get used to each other (but now Pug switches people every match, so no get used) ,..I was mainly in Pugs before ,..many were crap , but also quite a good amount actually became awesome stressful matches with no clear winner until close to finish - now I had almost no good matches ,..in 4 playing days ,.,..it were either hardcore losses or hardcore wins,..means it was clear very early how it will end. 

in numbers: before around 50% matches were garbage (doesnt matter win or loss) and around 30% turned out to be really interesting ,..20% were just "something" 

now its 90% garbage matches and 10 % interesting 
and I dont think i was unlucky in q , as a garbage match is also garbage for the opposite team ,..maybe just get more honor, but still garbage

Edited July 13 by Hemoride